Première audition - 04.05.2007 (11h30)
As she is a British citizen and does not understand written or spoken Portuguese, she is assisted by the interpreter, Filipa Silva. She has been on holiday in Portugal since last Saturday, 28th April, staying at the OC resort in P da L, Lagos, together with her partner (Russell O'Brien), their two children and three couples (Gerald McCann and Kate Healy, Matthew Oldfield and Rachel Mampilly and David and Fiona Payne. The group also included Fiona Payne's mother, Diane Webster.
She was accompanied by her two children, E**a O'Brien aged three and E**e O'Brien aged on.
The other couples also brought their children, G***e Oldfield aged one (the daughter of Rachel Mampilly and Matthew Oldfield), L*** Payne aged two and S******* Payne, aged 11 months (daughters of David and Fiona Payne) and the twins Amelie and Sean McCann aged two and Madeleine McCann who would be four in two weeks time (children of Kate and Gerry McCann.They were on holiday, which they (the couples) had arranged from England where they are friends. They travelled through the MW agency. All the couples stayed in individual apartments in the same resort, with their respective children.
Since Saturday the routine was that they would almost all get up at about 07.30-08.00 and then would have breakfast in a restaurant near to their accommodation, called the Millenium (6), taking their children at about 09.00 AM to three different areas of the Kids Club (2) (4) (5) according to the children's' ages.
Only the McCann couple would have breakfast in their apartment, due to the fact that they had three children and because it was complicated to walk with the three at the same time. After this they would also take their children to the Kids Club.
As regards the Kids Club, she clarifies:
E**a O'Brien and Madeleine McCann were in a room in a building near to the reception and English lady called Cat Baker was responsible for them. Apart from her, there were three or four more persons looking after the children, she only remembers one name (Emma Wilding). They would do various activities, such as going to the indoor pool at the resort, they would go to the tennis court, situated outside near to the Tapas restaurant, they would got to the beach (outside), they would paint and play (inside the resort). Scarlet Payne was also near to the reception but in another room different to the one E**a and Madeleine were in. She does not know who was responsible or who the employees who worked in this room were. As regards G***e Oldfield and E**e O'Brien, Amelie and Sean McCann, they were all in one room near to the Tapas restaurant. The person responsible for GO and E**e O'B was an English citizen called Leanne Wagstaff. As regards L*** Payne, Amelie and Sean, without knowing for certain, she says that the person responsible was Stacy Portz. The activities were identical to those of the other rooms, both inside and outside of the resort. At about 12.30 they would all go and fetch their children from the respective Kids Club rooms, as these would close, and go have lunch.
They would sometimes have lunch together in one of the couples' apartments. At about 14.30 the Kids Club rooms would open again and the only children who returned to the rooms were Madeleine, E**a, Amelie and Sean.The other children would stay with their respective parents.
At about 16.45 all the children would meet for tea in an annex to the Tapas restaurant. It was the employee Cat Baker who would take E**a and Madeleine. During the time they were having tea, the children's' parents would come and collect them.
Until 3rd May she has no knowledge of anything strange or suspicious having happened to the group of friends or to the children.
Yesterday the witness did not go to breakfast because she had tennis booked for 09.00. It was her partner who took her daughters for breakfast, having previously taken E**a O'Brien to the Kids Club. E**e O'B who was not feeling well, did not go to her Kids Club room and went with her father to look for the witness. They arrived at about 09.30 having waited for almost 30 minutes for the tennis lesson (8) to have finished.
The witness played tennis with Kate and with Diane Webster. She does not know where Kate's children had breakfast, but knows that the three of them went to their respective rooms in the Kids Club. She supposes that it was Gerry who took them there. During the tennis lesson Kate behaved normally. After the tennis lesson the witness went with her partner and daughter E**e to the beach where they stayed until about 12.20. After this, they went to pick up E**a from the Kids Club. She does not know what Kate did after leaving the tennis courts between 10.10 and 11.10.
She does not remember whether Madeleine was still in the room when she went to pick up her daughter, E**a. They both went to their apartment taking their daughters with them. Mathew and Rachel and their daughter also appeared and had lunch with them. They had lunch between 12.45 and 13.45, afterwards at about 14.00 the witness played tennis again with Rachel. Her daughters and Rachel's daughter stayed in the apartment with their respective parents. She remembers that when she was playing tennis, she saw Kate and Gerry arrive at the children's playground, next to the tennis courts, with their three children. Kate waved to her. They stayed at the playground until 14.40 when they went to take the children to the Kids Club.
After finishing playing tennis at about 14.45, the witness went to her apartment where she stayed with her daughter E**e, her partner had gone sailing with Matthew. At about 15.45 she went to the beach with Rachel, Diane, Fiona, L*** and Scarlet Payne, taking her daughter E**e along. Meanwhile Russell arrived from the boat trip and went straight to pick up E**a from the Kids Club. They joined the witness at the beach where they stayed until 18.10-18.15. "When she went to the beach she saw the MCs having a personal tennis lesson. No children were with them. Around 17h15 she saw KMC pass the beach "jogging", she having waved."
Russell, Matthew and David left the beach a little earlier to go to the tennis court, it was men's tennis evening. When the witness, together with her friends and children returned from the beach at about 18.20, they passed by the tennis courts and saw all the men, including Gerry on court. They stayed there talking to them until about 20.30 (sic). Gerald behaved normally. She thinks Kate was in the apartment putting the children to bed.
At about 19.00 they all went back to their own apartments with the children. The witness bathed her children, read them a story and put them to bed. E**e who was unwell and having trouble sleeping, stayed with her father, who had arrived in the meantime. The witness went for dinner at the Tapas restaurant at about 20.30. When she arrived at the restaurant several members of the group were already there, without their children. They were all presumably sleeping.
At about 21.00 her husband arrived at the restaurant, having got E**e to sleep. For this reason and because Fiona, David and Diane only arrived at about 21.00, the dinner, reserved for 20.30, only began after 21.00.
Elle se souvient que vers 21h10, Gerald a quitté le restaurant pour se rendre à son appartement et surveiller ses enfants. Cinq minutes plus tard, le témoin est parti pour aller chez elle et voir si ses filles allaient bien. C'est à ce moment-là qu'elle a vu Gerry parler à un Anglais appelé Jez, qu'ils avaient connu pendant les vacances. Ils ont joué au tennis avec lui. Elle passa devant eux en sachant que Gerry était déjà dans l'appartement pour vérifier ses enfants.
Entre temps, un homme est apparu portant un enfant avec une promenade précipitée, ce détail étant lié au fait que l'enfant était vêtue en pyjama, sans être enveloppée dans une couverture, qui a attiré son attention. Elle ne réussit qu'à avoir une vue de côté de lui avec l'enfant dans ses bras. Elle a remarqué la présence de la personne juste après son passage par Gerry et Jez qui discutaient, après l'avoir vue descendre du trottoir le long de l'immeuble où ils se trouvaient et traverser rapidement la route. L'entrée de l'immeuble est située dans la rue. d'où l'individu est apparu.
About 15-20 minutes later, her husband Russell and Matthew left to check on the children. As her daughter E**e was restless and crying, Russell stayed in the apartment. Meanwhile Matthew went to check his child and those of Kate and Gerry. According to what he said, he saw the twins but he did not see Madeleine. As there was no noise he supposed that all was well and returned to the restaurant. Matthew informed the witness that Russell had stayed in the apartment.
After having quickly eaten her main course, the witness went to her apartment in order to take over from Russell, so that he could have his dinner. When she was in the apartment, at about 22.00- 22.15 she heard Kate and Fiona shouting and saying that Madeleine had disappeared. When asked, she says that she thinks it was Kate who discovered the girl to be missing, the witness is not sure due not being in the restaurant at that time.
During all the evenings they carried out these procedures, they would get up from the table and check that everything was well with the children.
Madeleine was a lovely, very friendly, very active, playful girl. She likes to jump around. She was intelligent and (the witness) does not believe that if a stranger had approached she would not have shouted.
She says that of all the holiday group, the couple she knows least well are Kate and Gerry. She does not remember Kate had ever mentioned that Madeleine slept badly or had caused any kind of problems.
Dark skinned individual, male sex, aged between 35-40, slim physical appearance, about 1.70m tall. Very dark, thick hair, longer at the back (she could only see him from behind). He was wearing linen type cloth trousers, beige to golden in colour, a "duffy" sic type jacket (but not that thick). His shoes were dark in colour, classic type. He had a hurried walk. He was carrying a child, who was lying on both his arms, in front of his chest. By the way he was dressed, he gave her the impression that he was not a tourist, because he was very "warmly dressed".
The child whom appeared to be sleeping, she only saw her legs. The child appeared to be older than a baby. She was barefoot and was wearing what appeared to be cotton pyjamas of a light colour (possibly white or light pink). She is not certain, but has the impression a design on the pyjamas, possibly a floral pattern, but she is not certain. As regards these details, she does not know what Madeleine was wearing at the moment of her disappearance, because she did not talk to anyone about this. As she concerns the man she saw, she only spoke to Gerald about this, not entering into details, and to the police.
When asked, she says she would probably be able to identify the individual she saw, being able to identify him from the side and from his manner of walking.
Curieusement, Jane se dit capable de reconnaître Tannerman à son allure, tandis que Martin a reconnu Smithman à "sa manière de porter" embarrassée.
Remarquons que SY n'a pas songé à confronter Jane TB à Crecheman (substitué à Tannerman). Pourquoi ?
Since she became a mother (of El, almost 4 years old), she went to Italy to the above wedding ; to Germany to visit a friend (a former colleague of ROB, named B.D. - she was a trainee at the place where her husband worked in England). Also she went to Australia in Nov/Dec 2006 for six weeks. On that trip she went with only her companion and the two girls. In May 2005 she was in Greece for one week with ROB and her daughter. It was the first time they travelled using the Mark Warner agency.
Also they had had holidays in England in August 2004 (Cornwall) and April 2006 (Longleat nature reserve). Those holidays were spent solely with DP and FP, and their respective children. With the MC they began to meet at parties, for example weddings and birthdays. She met KMC's mother, whose name she does not recall, on MMC's third birthday last year, but she didn't get to know any of the other MC family members, knowing that both had siblings but not knowing other details.
This was the first time that all four couples had holidayed together.
She knows that, in Sept 2005, the MCs and the WPs holidayed together in Majorca, she [and ROB] not having joined them because of her advanced state of pregnancy.
Asked about her private life she said that she [has] never had marital problems with her companion, saying that she believes it is "100%" at all levels.
As for the professional life of GMC, that he is a cardiologist, and of her companion ROB, that he works/specialises in 'Emergencies' [and] said that her husband [has] never had any disciplinary or criminal action in relation to his profession.
About GMC, on this subject she does not know if he had any problem at any time.
They caught the plane directly from Gatwick to Faro at 08:30 on 28 May 2007. The agency that organised it was Mark Warner. They arrived at Faro airport at 10:00. They went to the "Ocean Club" tourist complex in Praia da Luz-Lagos in a Mark Warner bus. The journey was made with her companion and daughters together with the Oldfield couple, Matthew and Rachael, along with their daughter.
As for the Payne and McCann couples, they journeyed by plane from East Midlands to Faro, having arrived around 11h00. They took a taxi from Faro to Luz arriving at 12h00 also on 28 May.
On the plane they did not know anyone specific, allowing, as usual, for someone with children to have introduced [themselves] and made some comment. On the other hand, she recalls one couple on the plane who changed seats because her girls were making a lot of noise, which is normal because, like all kids, they are very restless.
On arrival the rooms were already assigned, [they] having asked, when buying the holiday in England, to stay in apartments close to one another. The only change needed was, due to the children (?), the flights at different times as said above.
As for the holidays, on the first day (Saturday, 28 April 2007) they had dinner in the complex, making their way to Restaurant Millenium. No-one booked dinner at that restaurant, all, including the children, having gone for dinner around 18h00. The Millenium used to serve dinner on other days (except Saturday) only from 19:30 and, for this reason, they decided to start dining at the Tapas, seeing that, in addition to the above, they would be closer to the apartments. This was discussed at the table in the Millenium on the first night.
Dinner was taken at the Tapas in order to be closer to the apartments where the children were sleeping.
At first dinner was booked each day having later been diarised as a permanent booking for 20h30 until the end of the stay. C'est ce que prévoyait le règlement, mais non ce qu'ils ont fait.
It is normal (culturally, traditionally, education/examples seen) [for] English tourists to leave, for some time, their small children alone in the bedroom/apartment to sleep while the parents are absent, normally guaranteeing that it is done for short periods of time (15/30 minutes). At those times there is a sporadic check, in time, of the places where the children are. Démenti par nombre de touristes britanniques.She admitted that on her holiday in Greece she also left her daughters alone in the apartment knowing that there were two or three child-minders in the block where they stayed to take care of/ascertain the noises (screams, cries, or other), [it being] incumbent upon [the minders] to notify the parents who, meanwhile, were absent. Those holidays were also organised by Mark Warner.
Expérience du baby listening.
Since it was asked of her, she affirmed that she had no knowledge that the MCs had left the patio sliding door open, suspecting, however, that they did because she saw, several times, the couple climb the steps at the rear of the apartment. Dans la journée, oui, mais GMC passait par l'autre porte et ouvrait la porte-fenêtre.
Ne veut-elle pas se souvenir de ce que KMC a dit à table, demandant sans attendre de réponse si elle avait bien fait de laisser la porte ouverte ? Ou n'a-t-elle pas entendu ?
Questioned, she relates that, from memory, she always saw the blinds of the McCann apartment totally closed, it being a place where she placed her ear to know if any of them were asleep. Personally, in relation to her daughters, she has not habitually adopted this posture, namely, to leave them alone, having done it only because all the couples of the group did it. However she locked all the doors, also the external blind of the children's bedroom.
As for the security methods effected by the adults in relation to the children, when they went to dinner and the children remained sleeping in the apartments, the deponent clarifies that, in the first days each couple went in rotation to check their own children. As days passed they were asking one of the members who had stood up if they had heard any noise at their apartment. However, the deponent and her husband maintained regular checks on their own children.
In the tourist complex last Sunday, 30 April, she net a couple she knew from Exeter, Jim and C. G., with their son of 20 months, B.G. She knew they had travelled on the same day as her, on a different flight. Asked, she relates that they had a hired car, not knowing the brand, model or colour. He (Jim) liked to surf and that was why he had hired the car.
Not untrusting, she never suspected that anyone might do harm to any of the children, never having observed any [such] behaviour by clients, workers or other people with [either] the group or children.
Of the group only DP and FP knew/had been to her home at the above address in Exeter. None of the other group members had ever been to her home.
About 2 May, the day before the disappearance of MBM, from memory, at 09h00 the deponent had a tennis lesson with Kate.
Every day they had breakfast at the Millenium restaurant and only afterwards did they take the children, on foot, to Kids Club, it being that ROB took El to Mini Club and she took Ev.
Questioned about the route that the MCs took with their children to Kids Club (since they took breakfast in the apartment), she said she did not know.
At 10h10 the children at Kids Club, her daughter El (and MMC), a total on six children including them, also had a tennis lesson. The responsible adults at the time were Cat and Georgina (tennis instructor). Kate was, together with the deponent, watching the lesson of their respective girls. The witness left before the class ended, not recalling if KMC left at the same time or later.
She went to the beach where she met David et Fiona WP. She and other members of the group made the acquaintance of, in the course of their tennis classes, a lady called O., the deponent's husband, ROB, also knew the lady's husband named Rob from windsurf classes. The couple (Rob and O.) were also guests at the complex. That morning, after having been to her daughter's tennis class, the deponent went to the beach meeting Rob there. From what she knows, the couple Rob and O. have two children (a girl of 3 years and a younger child, not knowing if it was a boy or girl). She thinks they were Londoners. They were "normal" people.
While she was sailing, her husband stayed at home with Ev who was sick and indisposed. Questioned, she relates that this type of behaviour is normal with the British, namely, it is not necessary for both adults to sacrifice themselves when children are sick. The usual procedure in these situations is for them to divide the time and the tasks between them. She recalls that after the boat trip she was with her husband and girls, all having gone to lunch at the apartment of the WP. She is not sure but thinks that MO and RMO also lunched with them in the apartment. She does not know where the MCs lunched.
After lunch, after they took El to Kids Club, ROB went to the beach for a canoe class while she rested in the bedroom with Ev. After her daughter woke up she went with her to the children's play area ("slides") next to the pool. She doesn't remember, but as GMC usually had tennis classes every afternoon, she thinks that he could have been on the court. As for KMC, she does not know if she saw her during the afternoon.
As usual at 17:00, they were at the children's tea with Kate, the time at which they would go to find [pick up] the children. With Kate and Gerry she went to the tennis courts where the adults and children of the group played [seriously] and played [for fun], respectively, with each other. They were at the courts until 19h00. At that time the men of the group (though she was not sure if GMC was there) stayed a while longer to play tennis, the women went to their respective apartments to get [the children] ready for bed. 20-30 minutes later the men arrived. They got themselves ready for dinner. At 20h35, as El didn't want to sleep, ROB went to the restaurant alone. Around 20h45, El fell asleep and the deponent also left for the restaurant. When she arrived everyone else was already there, except for Rachael who was feeling poorly and stayed in her apartment. Her husband, MO, was at the restaurant. She doesn't recall if the WP were already there. It is usual for them to always be last to arrive, since they were always late.
About dinner, she relates that nothing abnormal happened regarding the checking of the bedrooms, it having been done in turns as usual.
Questioned about an episode where she related that one of the twins, Sean and MMC had cried in the night (the one prior to the events) she said she knew of that situation but only from the beginning of dinner on 3 May when KMC commented at the table that MMC had, that morning, asked the reason why her parents had not come to the bedroom when she and her brother had cried (the previous night). Asked, she says that none of the adults were aware of that situation on the night that it supposedly occurred.
On Wednesday (2 May), after the dinner that went as normal, like the previous days, they had stayed later to have a drink at the bar returning to their apartments close to midnight.
As for 3 May she related in the same manner exactly the same activities/routines/times of that day, as had been described in her previous testimony. The times/intervals were exhaustively confirmed.
Requested to clarify certain details she said:
To confirm that the first time that she went to the beach with the children was 3 May in the morning. Only on 3 May (Thursday) afternoon she met the group, almost all, in Prais da Luz, except for the McCanns because they had a private tennis class together.
Around 17h15 she saw KMC "jogging" on the beach, having waved [a hand].
Her husband ROB, MO and DP left the beach a little earlier they having gone to the tennis courts, it was the night of the men's tennis. When she, together with the friends and children, returned from the beach, at 18h20, they went to the tennis courts having seen that all the men, including GMC, were on the court. They stayed to talk to them them for about 20/30 minutes. GMC comported himself as usual.
She thinks that KMC was in the apartment getting the children ready for bed.
Around 19h00 each one went to their apartment with the children. She bathed her daughters, she read them a story, she put them to bed. Ev was sick and had difficulty with sleeping stayed with her father, who had arrived in the meantime, (on the previous night the deponent stayed later in the bedroom because her daughter had difficulty in sleeping; on this night it was her husband's turn). She left the apartment and went to the Tapas, for dinner, around 20h30.
Around 21h00 her husband arrived at the restaurant, Ev, meanwhile, having fallen asleep.
As usual, the WPs and mother DW were late. A few minutes to 21h00 MO left the restaurant and went to the apartment area, saying that he would 'hurry up' the couple that was already late enough. She related that MO, on the way, took the opportunity and looked in on the children's bedrooms. She relates that MO passed the Paynes and DW on the way, but, benefiting from them already being up and on their way [i.e. because he did not have to go all the way up to their apartment], he made a circuit to listen at the homes, detecting nothing abnormal.
They ordered dinner and waited for the starters when, about 21h10, GMC left the restaurant having gone to the apartment to see his children. Five or ten minutes later the deponent left, having gone to her apartment to check that all was well with her girls. At that time she observed GMC talking to an English citizen called Jez that they had met on these holidays. He played tennis with them. She doesn't know if they saw her giving the assurance that, on her part, she did not start a conversation with either of them.
She passed them knowing that GM had already been in the apartment to see the children.
She doesn't recall the position/orientation of either Jez or GM while they spoke to each other on the street, only having the perception that one was on the pavement and the other was in the road next to the other. Jez had a baby carriage, the deponent knowing that he had a small child.
Prompted, she clarified that the reason she left, following GMC only 5/10 minutes later, she relates that she did it because she knew that he would only go to his apartment, reiterating that she checked her daughters regularly.
Questioned about the path she took on the way to her home, she relates that she left the reception at the entrance to the Tapas/pool area and went up the pavement to the corner, having entered the apartment by the front door, which was, as already stated, locked. The only access to the interior of the home is by that door, seeing that the windows and the sliding patio door to the lounge were locked from the inside, it being this way that they are only passable if they are opened, also from the inside.
Asked [about] the route of GM to his home when he went to check on his children, she relates that she does not know, but that she knows that he, at times, accessed the home by the glass lounge door which was only closed but not locked. She explains that this was the easiest and fastest way to enter the MC apartment as they have a stairway up to the veranda which is next to the pavement, saving thereby half [the distance of] the route. Questioned, she relates that all the couples had to access their respective apartments by the front door, except the McCanns since they were the only ones who left the glass door unlocked.
Prompted to say if she checked the state of the windows and external blinds of the MC children's bedroom when she went to her house, she relates that no, she did not look in that direction, hence they might already have been open without her having noticed.
After having gone to see the child she returned to the restaurant. On her return GMC was no longer talking where she had seen him.
When she arrived at the restaurant GMC was already seated at the table accompanied by his wife KMC and all the others.
Between 15 to 20 minutes later her husband ROB and MO left, together, and went to see their respective children. As her daughter Ev was restless and crying ROB stayed in the bedroom.
GMC est parti à 21h05/10, Jane est partie 5' ou 10' plus tard, donc 21h10/20, disons 21h15. Elle ne peut être de retour avant 21h14. Or ROB et MO partent à 21h25, soit 10 minutes après le retour de Jane. Drôles de rondes toutes les demi-heures..
Meanwhile, MO went to check his children and the MC ones. According to what he said, he saw the twins but he did not see MMC probably because he did not enter the bedroom. As he heard no noise he left presupposing that all was well, returning to the restaurant. MO told her that ROB had stayed in the bedroom. After having quickly eaten the main course she went to the apartment to take the place of her husband so that he could finish his meal. Her husband returned to the restaurant. Some time later, she doesn't know precisely how long, she looked through the lounge window towards the restaurant area, ascertaining, strangely, that there was no-one seated at the table it being that it was still very early for all of them to have already finished the meal. Later she heard voices of KMC and FWP who were in the corridor in front of the bedroom windows and who called, desperately, for Madeleine. When she saw her it was KMC herself who told the deponent that Madeleine had disappeared, not clarifying in what circumstances, continuing her search. The deponent stayed in her apartment because her daughter, El, was asleep and the smallest, Ev, was still awake and complaining.
As it was asked of her she relates that she did not go into the MC apartment therefore she does not know the state of the bedroom nor any details of what happened that night. Now, already she had heard many versions or theories of what could have happened, but, for her part, she can only affirm that the man that she saw carrying the child was, in her belief, associated with the disappearance of MMC.
She was then confronted with the fact that when her husband ROB and MO went to check their respective children the window already might have been open and MMC probably no longer in her bed. She clarifies that she cannot answer for them but thinks that MO had not entered the McCann children's bedroom, limiting himself to hear that there was no crying and that the twins were in their beds. Asked if he couldn't have checked for noise at the bedroom window, as had been done many times, une fois au moins, the deponent clarifies that MO had assured the parents that he would go to check the state of the children from inside the house.
Confronted with the information that the [tracker] dog teams had followed MMC's scent trail which did not pass the intersection where she indicated a man carried a child, she affirmed, immediately, that she was not lying, maintaining the honesty of her initial version. Mais sa version initiale n'est pas celle-là.
Here there is a quandry: the quotes around the word "heel" suggest that she is not describing the footwear. There are at least three English phrases that could fit the written description:
- the man was 'fleet-footed', i.e. fast and light on his feet; - this is my choice.
- the man was 'light in the loafers';
- the man was 'showing a clean pair of heels'.
Subsequently, she had no doubts that it could have been MMC because, through conversations with FP in which [FP] described the pyjamas that MMC had worn that night, which coincided with those she had seen. Questioned why she had not commented to KMC what she had seen that night, namely that she had seen a male individual who carried a child with pink pyjamas, she relates that she always avoided making this comment to the MCs so as not to torture them more in their suffering.
Traduire : pourquoi Jane aurait-elle été l'oiseau de mauvais augure alors qu'elle n'était même pas une amie des MC. Pourtant Jane a parlé de Tannerman dans la nuit du 3/4 mai, sauf qu'elle n'en a pas parlé de la même manière que le lendemain... Dans son premier récit, elle ne le voit pas traverser Francisco GM et elle ne vient pas de dépasser GMC et JW.
She swore "by everything most sacred" that what she said is true, namely that she saw an individual with a child on his arms. Confronted, she demonstrated the distance at which the man with the child had passed her, and that was gauged to be about 5 metres. She accepts that, at that moment, although the event had called her attention, she didn't lay any great stress on it for the reasons already explained.
La raison principale étant qu'elle sait que GMC vient de sortir du G5A.
Regarding the most and best information that might help the present investigation she said she remembered on one night (she thinks it was Tuesday, 1 May) there were two couples, supposedly English, that dined in the Tapas restaurant. After [their meal] they left, [JT] not knowing if they participated in the quiz game that Mark Warner put on during the meal. The game consisted of a MW quiz lady asking questions about films, namely quotations with the objective of identifying the films. At the end the tables were given a questionnaire that gave the source and a result. The first prize was a jug of sangria, curiously won by the deponent's table. She remembered only [that] the quiz lady commented on the two couples who had left the game before the final result was known. She never saw those couples before nor since that day. She does not know if they were Mark Warner clients.
Prompted to clarify which member of the group booked the first dinner at Tapas she responded that she did not know. She clarifies that, that morning, she played tennis with Kate going, at the end of the game, to the restaurant to make the booking. She recalls that, when they arrived there, the booking was already made and she had not questioned who had made it. Asked if it would have been her companion ROB who booked that meal, on his own initiative, she relates that it could have been done by any other person but considers [someone with] an excessively organised disposition would have done it, [something] usual of her companion.
On these holidays, she never met nor dined (along with the rest of the group) with any family or person having the surname "Irwin".
Other than RMO, as already stated previously, only on the first day (Saturday night) was there a group member, MO, feeling indisposed (ill) and not having eaten dinner on Sunday. On Monday he had recovered.
Still about the security procedures relating to the children, asked, the deponent clarifies that the WPs were the only ones who never went to their apartment because they had, at the table, an intercom device of good quality and power/range that allowed them to hear any noise caused by their children. She adds that, from memory, it was the first time they had used the device on holidays but it is a common procedure in their home, as the deponent has seen for herself.
Questioned, she reaffirms that she doesn't have any suspicion to put forward - other than the individual referred to as carrying a child on his arms - she doesn't recall any detail or situation that might be related to the disappearance of small MMC.
Asked, she relates that she does not recall any incident or argument between any of the couples, or any of the group members individually, nor between them and any third parties. Until the 'unsuccessful/failed' disappearance of MMC, the holidays had been peaceful and fun, like all such other holidays of the group of friends.